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some thoughts on luck, damage, and dexmud

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Posted by Poetry on 02/24

After some chatting with friends, I have concluded that a lot of the so-called balance problems here on legend would be solved if we just had more hp, mana, and move all round. Lets go back to dexmud for a sec. Back then the average pkiller had around 900-1000 hps with sanc ring. Damage cap was 60 on stunned and only 30 on standing and 39 on bashed (out of the sanc modified 1000). Im not saying that this damage is better, or good.. or accurate, but I am saying that cause of the overall lower damage, fights lasted longer. Tumble was never a big issue, cause both sides had enough chances to tumble and the luck evened out. Thesedays, take the hps, and bring them WAY down.. to about 400-600. Now take the new damageroll and damage cap and up it to 89. Dont forget that in dex mud, you could only hit harder than 39 hps on a headbutt or some sort of stun... and thats against a 1000hp character on average... In the current system, the cap is accessable by big damage hitters on standing or sitting too... and yes, people cap on bashes. Now add in that hook item. That item lets you do an extra 15-20 or whatever hps on top of the damage cap. Also add in some weapons that have extra attacks specials.. and you get another minor attack that adds more damage. Add in 75 hp firestorms... add in 80 hps backstabs. Damage was upped ALOT, and hps were downgraded.. What you end up with is a fight thats all about the luck of the first 2 specials... if I get a wfw on a fighter... they are practically dead... if they get 2 dazes or 2 bashes in a row.. I am dead... if a sniper gets a big para (and knows how to use it.. snipers actually do take some skill), they win.. Get the picture? We simply dont have enough hps to make our excellent fight system work... Wonder why no one uses choke in pkill? Cause it paras about as often as warcry, only dex fighters dont have the hps to tank long enough to wait for it to kick in.... This problem is more evident now than EVER. Before the grad stats code, spam healing allowed players to have more "virtual hps" and the luck of specials had more time to even out. I really think we need some sort of change to the length of the fights. I suggested removing all damage and hit items... thinking it would make fights longer and a little less luck-based but no one liked the idea... maybe giving us some extra stamina will make a wfw, double daze, or parabackstab a little more recoverable. I dunno, just some observations I made while chatting with some friends. Poetry

From: Poetry Wednesday, February 23, 10:59AM I would like to add that there are lots of fun things in pkill that just arent as feasible thesedays cause the fights last such a short time... I would love use more of my non damage spells in combat... sneaking in a weaken or something.. even blind that takes 2 rounds of precious combat time and is often just dispeled away seems not worth it to me.. I would rather just hit them with a big damagespell... if we could last a little longer I would try all kinds of things... fears, blinds, weakens, even curse....limn, things that just dont make sense to waste 2 or even 1 precious combat round on. Thesedays, NEED a tumble to try a blind or something like that... since you cant spam spells like headbutt, I rarely get first special in, if I get bashed, I HAVE to run to cure crit.. trying a blind or curse spell or weaken or something like that, is suicide.. 2 bashes in a row kills. Im not whining about my character vs others.. in the last 95 or so fights I lost about 3 times. But my formula is pretty standard.. because the shortness of fights really limits what I can try. If we had a little more time in fights, we can do so much more. Stun/hope for wfw gets boring fast. Hunt/headbutt hunt/headbutt gets boring too... I would love to see 2.stun come back.. that is the most missed feature of dexmud, imho. With all the damage that people do, you cant get tricky and take on 2 pkillers. For all that dont know, 2.stun is what me and Splat use to refer to stunning 2.target while fighting 1.target. In the old system, stunning 2.target will keep them stunned till the tick unless they are woken by their companion. GOOD players had ALOT more to work with back then... Thesedays, a well made newbie can bash twice, get lucky and beat an oldbie... that makes me depressed. I think Im talking too much. Poetry

From: Nothing Wednesday, February 23, 11:41AM I have to agree that the fights go by much too fast, I rarely if ever warcry/elbow because there isn't the time to hope for a para warcry or disorient.

From: Zalbag Wednesday, February 23, 11:48AM currently after major testing with golbez and magnifico last night my conclusion is this. its all luck! i tumbled 4 out of 12 times i have 99 dex and 40perc. basically i tested through wary and agg. at 3 wary i tumbled 2/3 times. 2 wary i didnt tumble 1 wary i didnt tumble at not wary/agg i tumbled 2/3 times its pure luck and its annoying. shows no skill. i can't survive against the numerous amounts of str people everywhere with the way tumble is based. and another concern of mine fighting over mages is just a long drawn out fight i have seen 60mind people eat most of my 3rd circle spells. i have 100mind. so i put in an extra 40 stat points into mind my only benefit is stun against other mages. but then someone else can put 40 stat points into con for more hp. i want my benefit of my spell s getting through the majority of the time. too luck based there

From: Infidel Wednesday, February 23, 11:59AM Well o'course I agree, I said con should get around 800 hps when we were rerolled.. One thing to consider is mobs though, sure we could give them 35% more hps but then levelling's gonna get even slower with longer fights and slower healing.. -shrug- I say give us more hps and screw the mobs. :P

From: Job Wednesday, February 23, 06:08PM Up the percentage reduction on pkill damage. That would make fights last longer...

From: Lagmonster Wednesday, February 23, 10:52PM Upping the percentage reduction on pk damage is a tricky issue, since that will overpower healing by that much. Same goes with more hps, imho, since for me it's hard to say how much of an hp diff 60 con diff in stats should have, for it to balance out. A flat raise in hps would certainly benefit str/con more than any other chars imho, but a tilted raise would benefit low con mages, esp if we're talking increased mana as well. Pk fights do last a really short time... one successful bash, and a 40con char is reduced to 2/3rds (if lucky) or 1/2 (quite often) of his total... two good bashes end a fight... and to regen all those hps it takes.... If mob hps were increased, then we'd have hour long fights at low levels. I don't think anyone would have the patience to kill a mutt at lvl 1 without a skill since it'll prolly last a life time per fight :0 Not increasing mob hps, we'll have overpowered players. Whee, think some fighter chars are idiotically powerful against mobkill as is, esp with most fighter chars easily reaching 100/100/80 ish stats. 2.stun is something i'd like to see back, and choke is something i'd like to last as long as a dazing headbutt. Warcry too, i've seen too many 1 round para warcries... their success rate and the results just make them silly. Kick needs to be upped a bit, i think it does way too little damage for the 2 round delay it has. Sure it is a very safe skill to use, but of all the skills, it's prolly the least effective less you are in a situation with no other options. Elbow... don't even know how to go about it, for starters its damage should go up to at least kick levels. Also, there should be a way for non-spell casters to get detect hidden via potions, vials, poultices or scrolls. Hide is too powerful against non spell casters... at least snipers should have a chance to see hidden just like they have a chance to see sneaking. Lagmonster

From: Blackthorne Thursday, February 24, 03:52AM I dont really know if im the only non-enabled appending to this list just had a few things to say, i agree that the hit dam roll system should be changed, how im not sure. I based my character to have high dam roll and hit roll, for that i sacrificed hp. It annoys the hell out of me that i dam cap while sitting but i manage to slash while standing. The suggestion was made to get ride of dam and hit roll eq all together, granted this would make pkill fights longer, it would just annoy use theme characters who are not enabled . Correct me if im am wrong but there are more non enabled folks then pkillers out there. Id like to hear from someother nonenablers append to this post and get their opinion. This isnt just a pkill mud. Just my thoughts-thanks- Blackthorne

From: Infidel Thursday, February 24, 06:30AM but it should be.


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