Posted by LadyAce on 09/12
I'm sorry, I accidentally erased this thread :( I did a 'erase discussion
37' instead of 'erase discussion 37 3' which was my append :(
I'm sorry :(. To summarize what happened before my mistake:
Mornelithe posted the idea of having "skill spamming" (i.e. spamming kick
joe over and over waiting for joe to come in) cost you something (make you
fall over, etc.). A few players appended in support.
My comments were this:
It sounds like a good idea, if it's possible to put it in so as to only
catch true spamming. However, there are a few cases where 'anti skillspam'
code might work in ways we don't want it to -- the first few times
you try a skill on a mob which has fled, the last few times you attempt
a skill on a mob which has died, if you are typo'ing the name of the mob,
etc. the code wouldn't necessarily be able to tell if you're spamming in
expectation of someone coming in or making a mistake.
Thursday, September 07, 09:15PM
what about putting the skill lag onto spamming? That would be
a slight discouragement, but it wouldn't really hurt you if
you weren't trying to spam-kill.
Thursday, September 07, 09:19PM
Of course, you wouldn't want to put the timer in if there
was no target specified, like if you've typed kick five
times and only needed 3 to kill the mob.
Friday, September 08, 07:38AM
I disagree. If I spam headbutts, that doesn't mean that I'm standing
there making headbutts in the air. Instead, what this simulates is my
'readiness' to headbutt -- I'm in combat and my reactions are at their
highest, alert to the arrival of my opponent. I don't think this needs
to be changed at all.
Friday, September 08 2000, 05:44PM
I'd say a pretype is "readiness" -- actually doing the command
over and over, in game context, seems more like kicking the air
hoping some particular someone will run into your foot. I guess
the way I think of it, when you hit enter, that's like your
brain telling your body "do this thing" -- walk this way, say
this thing, etc.
I guess it depends on how you look at it, it's always struck me
as a break in the realism to spam stuff in, but that might just
be me. When the realism can go either way, though, the question
becomes balance/playability/fun, etc. and the people it will
really effect is more likely to be pkers. More opinions needed!
Friday, September 08 2000, 06:18PM
hmmmm dont know if I would liek this in pkill
I think it would benifit mages a little bit since we
cant spam spells. Honestly I would have to test pkill
with this change with a bunch of charas to see
who would get the better end of this deal
Friday, September 08 2000, 08:25PM
I dont see this as helpfull at all. Noone but the player
sees the skill spam. If there was a social for every kick
it would be a different story. But its not. If you want to
make fight skills more and more useless, as seems the
case lately, please by all means proceed. Then every one can
stick to making Snipers and 2nd or 3rd circle cause mages for
Friday, September 08 2000, 11:44PM
that's like saying you spam shoot, bullets go flying every time you spam
it and the person isn't around, which would be totally messed up
this is a useless change, and doesn't benefit anyone, except the mage
who wants to win a fight and is pissed off cuz he can't spam the person
Saturday, September 09 2000, 03:15AM
Bleh fighters are underpowered anyway, although it adds
more reality to the game, it's not a fair change.
mages still kick non-mages butts in the current system.. =P
Why hamper fighters more? Were the hit/dam and gauche not enough to
screw over str? =P
Saturday, September 09 2000, 10:29AM
Not good for laggers, bad enough already for someone that
lags to land spells on others at max wimpy.
Saturday, September 09 2000, 10:52AM
if the point is to discourage spamming you could just have skills
cost mv and ma. if things start costing you ma to use, then
it'll be interesting to see if the cost will hamper fighters or
mages more. the ma-recovering item isn't too renty for fighter
chars to rent anyway imho, and would hamper mages with a 100
in a fight skill or two fighting 'just as effectively' as plain
fighter chars as each option is eating up their mana supply.
or it could be made so that while spamming a skill regen stops
while poison and bleeding speeds up. haha.
anyway, i don't see much point in changing it, but it would be
interesting to ponder uses of such to balance chars.
Saturday, September 09 2000, 11:11AM
-no- fighters are overpowered at the moment
so this is definately not a balance issue :P heh
Saturday, September 09 2000, 11:54PM
my point exactly, drak.
have skills cost you 10 mana per, or more, who would it hurt
more... a fighter who has 300ish mana or a mage with 600ish
mana? each combat skill a mage uses are costing them
potential hps, among other things. For fighters... it'll
hurt them from spamming, but i can hardly see fighters surviving
long enough, or a battle lasting long enough to use 30 skills
in a pk bout. and if they do, well, there's always that item
which makes up for that, or the cost can go down. Regardless,
mages will be hurt by having their mana robbed where normally
they wouldn't... and having used up their mana in spells would
render them fairly helpless -- they won't have mana for skills
but anyway, it's not something i consider necessary atm.
Sunday, September 10 2000, 01:21PM
An interesting twist, Himura. It seems like I'm hearing that this is
not necessary now, but it's a good possibility to keep in the back
of the mind for the future, perhaps?
Sunday, September 10 2000, 10:07PM
It's no secret that I have focused on my spells and other magical
resources to the detriment of my combat ability. However, when my
mana is exhausted, I must resort to headbutts and warcries. If any
change goes in that requires mana to use simple combat skills, I
shall be entirely defenseless, being left with whatever damage I can
do with a skull staff and an 80 constitution.
I believe that this 'problem' of spamming skills is no problem at all,
and doesn't need any new code, now or ever.
Sunday, September 10 2000, 10:16PM
Sunday, September 10 2000, 11:44PM
Having skills cost Mana makes absolutly no sense,
since mana is an extension of mental stamina
Having skills cost Move makes more sense
besides, fighters tend to have more dex than mages
and more con (or whatever boosts move)
and I think the move cost should vary per skill..
depending on the athleticism of the spell
just a thought
Monday, September 11 2000, 11:13AM
I think its fine as is.. what skar said. If spamming was made more
difficult and costly, I would feel bad for laggers like Testboy.
One of mages biggest handicaps is the inability to spam spells. They
have other ways to get first attack when they enter a room. Fighters
need some sort of advantage and the ability to spam sounds good.
And besides spamming has its drawbacks too...
I wonder if something cool could be done with spamming shooting,
though... bullets flying through the air sounds cool to me. The only
problem I see is shooting with a bow, you shoot the air ONCE and you have
to reload. I wonder if we could make it so that shooters can shoot
through more than one room.. like 2 rooms away with a chance to miss
and hit some random target that then gets pissed and rushes. 2 room
accuracy can go way down... and the chance to hit something random
seems like fun.
I always thought its weird that my shooters "miss" so many shots, but
those stray arrows never hit anyone in the eye. I think shooting could
be upgraded a little (more stuns, bashes, 2 room shooting) if you allow
a chance for the shot to miss and hit aengus or something ever scarier
(if that exists). Maybe then you could allow shot spamming.
Just some ideas.
Tuesday, September 12 2000, 05:34AM
the point was to have mages helpless after they've used up their mana,
but anyway, it's not important, we all know what is 'overpowered' or
'advantageous' MOST of the time... and the rest of it is whether the
players bother going through 'tediousness.'
wow, where the hell did that come from, but regardless, anyone who
pk'd knows what kind of chars will net them the most victories under
'usual' circumstances... the problem being the frustration when finding
out other options aren't as feasible or tempting, i guess.