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eq for newbies

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Posted by Lethargio on 07/04

seems like the higher levels are quite annoyed by lower levels asking for eq. Theres a problem on the mud too though.

The problem is that there is no adequate supply of stat equipment for lower levels. I mean, it is almost impossible for a char under level 10 or even higher to get his/her own stat eq because all or most stat eq are gained from mobs instead of bought from stores.

What i think is that most shops should provide some medeocre equipment (net gain of +2 +3 +4?) at reletavely high prices, so there would be more importance in gaining money. Newbies would no longer have the excuse of being 'impossible' to get a cirtain stat, and it will give them a goal of aquiring money, and maybe make it more fun. (Shopping for eq at shops can be fun)

It will also be useful for high levelers after hitting a DT or lost eq in a crash, because it would give them equipment until they are able to stand on their feet again.

I also think that this can end the "newbies in Legend is too hard" thing, because the stat eq will also help them do better in battles, lowering death rates

my 3x0.02$

From: Rufus Wednesday, July 02, 08:17AM

There's some merit in what Leth has to say, but there are also some problems.

Newbies SHOULD be able to gain at least some +stat equipment at low levels. And there are a significant number of +stat items sold in shops, many of which make up the outfits of high levellers as well.

The problems:

1) making equipment 'high priced' at shops is counter productive. Rent and GP cost are the same value (this will be changing, but it's a massive issue that is both code and building related that will take a huge amount of time before it's even near complete). If this were the case, they could only rent a couple (or only 1) +2 or +3 stat item.

2) One of the rewards for hard-to-obtain eq (quest, difficult mobs, etc) is that the rent value of said items is lower, hence making the easy to obtain, higher priced gear less newbie friendly.

3) Giving what I consider 'good' stat bonus (+4 overall) to low level mobs would largely result in those mobs being slaughtered by high level players for the eq, and those mobs would rarely be available for those newbies to get gear themselves.

4) The 'oldbie' newbie barrage has tasted the sacred fruit. That is, they know what's out there for what rent costs and most will likely not settle for a +2 or +3 stat item when they know there's a +5 for just a wee bit more rent. Needless to say, that +5 item is generally on a mob they would not think of touching for at least another 40 levels or so.

What are the builders doing about it? Well, a couple of things. There IS a lack of +1 to +3 stat items. So we are adding these, many on relatively low level mobs. I have made a sort of 'under the table' mandate that said items however need to go into new areas, rather than old ones, seeing as there is quite a plethora of gear already available in the older areas.

I think by far one of the biggest shortcomings of the entire system is that the game becomes much faster paced, much more exciting at higher levels and the rush you get from gaining 111K from a mob at level 50 far outweighs the 50xp you get from killing a mouse at level 1, even though, compared to the exp to level, killing the mouse is bringing you across a larger gap toward the goal of the next level. And beyond popular belief, the 'newbie death rate' is more often caused by 1) defending mobs, which is something through experience (or experience loss, if that be the case) that true newbies learn, 2) a vast difference in level often brought on by the high-level attitude that 'death will thank you' is not really a threat (I have yet to meet a halfway decent warrior who could not tackle at least 30% of the level 50 mobs at level 40 or 42) or 3) what I have dubbed the 'superhero' mentality, that you should be able to tromp through mobs and lower levels without resting, without getting hurt. The fact is, that 95% of mobs under level 25 are both poorly equipped and do not have any fight acts which make them more difficult. A naked 'newbie' has the same total sum stats as level 5 or 6 mobs, add to that even a slight bit of +stat eq and a few skills, plus some AC gear, and they are an even match, or even better off, than most mobs under level 15.

A quick count in my head, and I'm sure, if given about 3 days I could come up with exact numbers, I count at least 30 items of at least +1 (and some even +5 overall) bonus that are either purchasable at shops or on mobs under level 15 (I know if at least 3 immediate items that are on mobs of under level 10).

I don't think the problem is near as bad as Leth makes it seem. I think the true problem lies in the fact that it is much easier to ask someone to obtain an item than it is to find out if anything is similar and fight the mob for one's self. If I know a +3 stat item is on a level 10 mob and I'm level 8, but there's another +3 of the same stat on a level 45 mob for maybe 100 less rent, I would be tempted to find a way to acquire the lower rent item.

I'm not saying there aren't problems with the system, but if we turn it around and make it able for characters under level 25 to easily obtain a huge amount of +stat items, they are (and do, if given items) far far better than mobs even 10 levels higher.


From: Nayone Wednesday, July 02, 09:25AM

I think Rufus is right. There's lots of stat gear out there that newbies can get, but true newbies often don't know how to find it, and oldbies don't want to 'settle' for what they can get themselves when they know what the higest stat gear is. Instead of telling a newbie they should get Nuada's arm, tell them they can buy an armenbande. Suggest where they can buy the best eq, because a lot of the non-quest stuff does show up in shops.

I'm a newbie character but a repeat player. When I started I killed ducks and fish in Egypt for money (I'm Arabian born). I bought an ash quarterstaff and a leather bracelet in Tara. When that wasn't enough to learn words, I asked for help on chat and someone got me another leather bracelet. When I could, I killed legionaries for better money. I went over rent, lost all my stuff, and had enough in the bank to buy it all back. Once I got 40k in the bank I chatted that other newbies should feel free to help themselves from the legionary corpses, cause I was just killing them for xp by then. When I needed help getting an item for a word quest, I chatted for help and someone helped me. I could afford all sorts of stat eq from shops in Tara, Roman Britain, HOL, and London by now (there may be other places with stuff in shops but I know those best), but as a half-naked mage I can cast all the spells I know, so I'm going to stay half-naked on the chance that I may find something really nice laying on the ground. I feel like I've done well, level 6 in 5 days, with one death and one eq-loss, and I only got help when I really needed gear in order to learn spells. People should try to be more self-sufficient and give true newbies useful advice about how to do things for themselves instead of saying they should ask for eq that they could never possibly get on their own.

More +1, +2, and +3 stat eq would still be nice tho Rufus. :)

From: Orca Friday, July 04, 12:25PM

I've always gone straight for +5 stat items (apart from those that are better value) when levelling in the past as there's little point in going half way around the world for a lesser item (with newbie mv's) only to replace it later.

What's needed is for at least half the items on the mud to be +stat or at least good AC, (i went for AC items over +stat during the test period since it actually helped then). I dunno why so many items need to be totally useless, nearly all other muds i've played you would identify every item where as here i can usually guess whether an item could be decentt just from the desc and level of the mob it comes from.

As for +1 or +2 items, well.. without any way of identifying items til level 10 you'll probably be looking for better by then anyways.

bah, screenfreeze... best end this here while i still can.


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