Lecture Serie
s Index

March 22nd, 2001

Q & A Index

Topics Covered

Increased Clan Memebrship Limits
Last Gangwars Cancelled?
New Imms?
Still Getting Hard Lag?
New Imms again
New Area Progress
Min Clan Membership Raised?
What is Admin's Job?
FAQs and Newbies
Helps System and Spell Helps
Higher Prereqs on Hunt Help?
Locate Spell
Limits on Charmed Mobs
KG vs LBS & Weight
Mana costs on failed spells
Recall/Rent while Fighting


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Increased Clan Memebrship Limits

LadyAce says, 'any questions or comments on code changes perhaps?'

Darla says, 'nice change to the clans'

LadyAce nods solemnly.

Tobias says, 'USL gets to get even bigger?'

Tobias ducks to the ground.

LadyAce says, 'they got full enough to warrant it'

Anson laughs with amusement.

Cenja giggles.

Kaige says, 'seemed to be reasonable, give the average member counts and number of friends too'

Ubiquity says, 'I doubt there are enough surgeons to fill 20.'

Nemoy smiles at Craven.

Darla says, 'I was just thinking the other day, that we should have less clans, with more people each, in order to strengthen the sense of community from being in a clan'

Tobias says to Ubiquity, 'They aren't all surgeons ^_~'

Nemoy shakes his head in disagreement with Darla.

Nemoy says, 'I disagree'

Ubiquity says to Tobias, 'in the USL? They all are surgeons.'

Tobias says to Ubiquity, 'What about the USL Thugs?'

Ubiquity says to Tobias, 'the thugs aren't actually in the clan.'

Tobias giggles.

Tobias says to Ubiquity, 'Oh.'

Tobias flops about helplessly.


Last Gangwars Cancelled?

Tobias says to LadyAce, 'We missed you at Gangwars!'

Tobias sniffles quietly.

Craven says, 'not me'

LadyAce says, 'missed me? there wasn't one scheduled...:P'

Craven says, 'I missed her the whole time!'

Tobias says to LadyAce, 'Lots of us were wondering why there wasn't one.'

Tobias giggles.

Craven says, 'I never heard about it being cancelled'

LadyAce says, 'It was never listed in events, and I did say at the last one that there wasn't one'

Tobias giggles.

Craven says, 'I'm probably just out of it'

LadyAce says, 'due to me being out of town and things'

Tobias says, 'You said you wouldn't make it to the last one.'


New Imms?

Craven says, 'you guys voted on imms yet'

Craven says, 'I wanna know who my new enemies are'

LadyAce says, 'we did vote'

Craven throws his head back and cackles with insane glee!

Anson snickers softly.

LadyAce says, 'we're talking to applicants right now and giving them results'

Craven says, 'cool'

Tobias says, 'Cool!'

Craven says, 'I hope at least one coder made it'

Darla nods her agreement with Craven.

Tobias nods solemnly.

Tobias says, 'When will the general public know about the results?'

LadyAce says, 'well, we have to contact all the applicants first...then imm them...and then you'll know'

Tobias nods his agreement with LadyAce.

Ubiquity says to Tobias, 'you should append that question with "Is there a time set for when they will be immed"'


Still Getting Hard Lag?

Ea! says, 'Okay, I've got a quick question:'

Craven cheers for Ea! - huzzah!

Ea! says, 'Has the lag been any better over the last few days?'

Craven says, 'yea'

Tobias nods his agreement with Ea!.

Craven says, 'you get the occasional burst'

Craven says, 'but not nearly as bad as it was'

Tobias says, 'Its still been hanging though.'

Smee says, 'yeah... its patchy'

Tobias says, 'Sometimes I get kicked off due to lag.'

Craven nods his agreement with Tobias.

Tobias says, 'That gets kinda bad.'

Ea! says, 'How frequently is it freezing and causing people to reconnect?'

Tobias grins evilly.

Heineken comforts Tobias.

Craven says, 'I haven't froze in awhile'

Godsmack says, 'quite often'

Tobias says, 'About once every two hours? Sometimes one hour.'

Craven says, 'few days'

Nemoy says to Ea!, 'very'

Kaige says, 'I haven't been seeing as many or as long mass disconnects and screen freezes'

Smee says, 'for me... like once every hour or so'

LadyAce says, 'we have been talking to our ISP and they keep saying that they thing it's fixed and we keep saying it's not. :)'

Nemoy nods his agreement with LadyAce.

Tobias says, 'When I get booted, though, other people do too.'

Anson nods his agreement with Tobias.

Tobias says, 'So its not just me.'

Tobias giggles.

Ea! says, 'The whole mud, 5 people, 10 people?'

Tobias looks up into the sky and ponders.

Nemoy says, 'half the mud'

Godsmack nods his agreement with Nemoy.

Nemoy says, 'quarter of the mud'

Tobias says, 'A good bit of the people we're around?'

Nemoy nods solemnly.

Tobias says, 'on a pd run, two or three peoples out of the group.'

LadyAce says to Ea!, 'I bet you could do a script on the err.log and see if you can see reconnects in big rows'

Tobias says, 'Which is about a third or fourth.'

Ubiquity says, 'Just the guys?'

Craven says, 'this lag still wasn't anything like texas lag'

Craven says, 'so I'm not upset :)'

LadyAce says, 'everything is bigger in texas!'

Craven says, 'it just seemed bad cuz we were used to the good life'

LadyAce winks suggestively at Kaige.

Tobias laughs with amusement.

Darla says, 'true ladies never have link problems'

Anson giggles.

Kaige says, 'yeah well, chicago's better connected to the rest of the world than Austin too'

Ubiquity says, 'I love when someone on my network is lagged to Legend, and I'm not, or vice versa.'

Heineken says, 'would it help if we kept ping logs for you?'

Kaige nods her agreement with Ubiquity.

Craven says, 'ping!'

Craven says, 'weird thing is'

Craven says, 'usually when I lag out'

Ea! says, 'When it freezes up, running a traceroute to the mud helps.'

Kaige says to Ubiquity, 'or two different windows and one is and one isn't'

Craven says, 'my ping isn't that bad'

Ea! says, 'That makes it easier to tell where it's at.'

Ubiquity nods his agreement with Kaige.

Craven says, 'I was froze out for 5 minutes once and have 9% packetloss'

LadyAce says, 'date & time stamps are most vital, if you can't do traces'

Sasha says to Craven, 'your ping sucks!'

Ubiquity says to Kaige, 'I'm not allowed to do that though'

Sasha laughs with amusement.

Ubiquity says, 'I imagine that when you're lagged, attempting to send ping packets would just clog it up a bit more.'

Craven says, 'pings don't take much'

Ea! says, 'Looking at the logs of when people reconnected, the only major set of reconnects in the last few days was yesterday at noon...'

Ubiquity says to Craven, 'the text of the mud doesn't take much either.'

Myrella grins evilly at a comfortable looking hammock.

Craven says to Ubiquity, 'exactly'

Ea! says, 'And that's when I screwed something up on the router trying to make it easier for our ISP to debug things.'

Craven says to Ubiquity, 'what what is a ping, like 32 bits?'

Heineken thinks Tobias made the whole thing up

Sandra giggles at Ea!.

Craven says to Ubiquity, 'thats 4 ascii characters :)'

Tobias peers at Heineken, looking him up and down.

Lorenzo says to Craven, '76 bytes.'

Lorenzo says to Craven, 'Usually.'

Craven says, 'fine :P'

Craven says, 'pings are teenie, thats the moral of the story'

LadyAce says, 'right now the mud is sending 2708 chars/second'

Craven says, 'hehe'

Tobias says, 'Pinging with giant 50 meg files wouldn't work ^_~'

Craven nods his agreement with Tobias.

Tobias giggles.

Craven says, 'I like this chigago placement of the machine btw'

Craven says, 'I average like 120ms on a 56k modem, its great :)'

Lorenzo says to Craven, 'the potential problem with pinging is not the total volume of the packet, it's the number of packets. It's a latency vs. bandwidth comparison.'

Craven says to Lorenzo, 'I know what your saying'

Craven says, 'your saying if I ping with 100 packets, and then EVERYONE else does the same'

Craven says, 'it bogs down the system'

Lorenzo nods his agreement with Craven.

Craven says, 'the point is the majority of people who play this game have no working knowledge of anything like traceroutes or pings'

Somar smiles happily.

Craven says, 'so we're fine :)'

Heineken says, 'you're creating more traffic than that just chatting'

LadyAce says, 'they do know how to set their zmud to try to reconnect fifty billion times a second :)'

Craven says, 'actually zmud won't'

Craven says, 'it won't let you set it below once per 10 seconds'

Nemoy nods his agreement with Craven.

Craven says, 'zugg is a smart guy'

LadyAce says, 'that's still bad :P'

Craven says, 'well'

Craven says, 'maybe if the mud didn't crash....we wouldn't have to worry about it :P'

LadyAce laughs at Craven.

Tobias says to Craven, 'Duck, I hear a gun.'

Ubiquity throws his head back and cackles with insane glee!

Nemoy grins evilly at Craven.. wonder what he's thinking...

Somar says, 'highly paid programmers at Microsoft can't keep their software from crashing completely :P'

Craven says, 'I know'

Lorenzo says to Somar, 'And?'

Craven says, 'highly paid doesn't mean highly knowledgable'

Emrysia smiles happily.

Craven says, 'but I know what your saying :)'

LadyAce says to Somar, 'it's a good comparison :) ... I bet their stuff is reminiscent of board.c'

Somar says, 'you can't expect flawless software from anyone ;)'

Somar says, 'board.c? is that scary?'

Lorenzo says to Somar, 'Certainly not from Microsoft, though. :p'

Somar says, 'I can make a flawless hello, world program :P'

LadyAce says to Somar, 'board.c is probably the scariest thing ever'

Anson chuckles politely.

Somar says, 'but once you get past several thousand lines of code, expectations of perfection I'm sure quickly dissipate'

Heineken says, 'what if you give batch files that log a traceroute to a file every minute or so to players and then then can collect info on the problem?'

Lorenzo says to Ea!, 'Or... what if you run a tail -f | grep on the log, and traceroute anyone who drops connection? :)'


New Imms again

Somar says, 'is there any word when it may be announced who gets promoted to immness?'

Somar fidgets impatiently.

Craven says, 'that was answered :P'

LadyAce says, 'after we tell them'

Ea! says, 'Some time after the Q & A tonight.'

Somar nods solemnly.

LadyAce says, 'and imm them'


New Area Progress

Nemoy says to LadyAce, 'are there any new areas under construction that you could give us a yummy tidbit about?'

Tobias laughs with amusement.

Tobias says, 'Hell will be cool!'

Tobias says, 'There's a tidbit.'

LadyAce says, 'I know Kae is making some progress on that. Lardarello it's called'

LadyAce says, 'the name makes me laugh too much to really appreciate it :)'

Nemoy says, 'anything else?'

LadyAce says, 'Leila's been doing more testing in London'

Nemoy nods solemnly.

Somar cheers wildly!

Godsmack peers around the room intently.

LadyAce says, 'that's all I've seen email on lately that I remember'

LadyAce shrugs helplessly.


Min Clan Membership Raised?

Tritoch says, 'is the lowest number of members in a clan raised tooooooo?' Ea! says to Tritoch, 'No, there's no plans to raise the minimum at this point.'

Tritoch nods solemnly.

Darla says, 'what about lowering the max number of clans?'

Somar says, 'that would only result in the small clans of inactive people being absorbed into larger clans of inactive people...'

Craven says to Ea!, 'interesting post on the pk discussion'

Craven says to Ea!, 'but completly predictable :)'

Ea! says to Craven, 'Yeah, it's predicatable because I've said it before when the same subject has been raised before...'

Craven nods his agreement with Ea!.

Craven says to Ea!, 'the problem still hasn't left'

Craven says to Ea!, 'kinda like the xp system'

Craven says to Ea!, 'it'll always be an issue'

Craven says, 'it would be interesting to see pk yanked, just to see how much the playerbase drops'

Tritoch says, 'bleh, i dont see why you guys care so much about them pk whiners, if they go into that oldstyle pk scene, and they get reamed and whine, then just delete that char for them :p'

Craven says, 'I wonder if it would be significant or not...'

Tritoch says to Craven, '6 players'

Ea! says to Craven, 'It's a trade off: which issue is worse? I'd rather have things be a little more boring than have people being harassed.'

Craven says, 'I posted about harassment'

Craven says, 'harassment exists, you can't code it out of existance'

Craven says, 'but you can keep trying :)'

Tritoch yells, 'yeah! i got harrassed in SL with pkok! but im too nice to whine about it:P'

Somar says, 'even though admin can take care of harrasment much more effectively ...'

Craven says, 'its kinda like trying to code out racial biases'

Ea! says, 'Sure, but we can try to empower players to give them more ways to protect themselves -- hence gag, etc.'

Somar likes gag and gagchan.

Craven says to Somar, 'EXACTLY what I said'

Craven smiles at Llewellyn.

Ea! says, 'It's too much work for the admins, and the details are often unclear, so it's hard for them to prevent it.'


What is Admin's Job?

Craven says, 'what is admins "premiere" duty?'

Craven says, 'fixing help files?'

Darla says to Craven, 'punishing you'

Craven says, 'I haven't seen an admin to punish me in months'

LadyAce says, 'dealing with the rules'

Craven says, 'I'm always "talked to" or punished by one of 3 people'

Craven says, 'sandra'

Craven says, 'ladyace'

Craven says, 'or kaige'

Darla chuckles politely.

LadyAce says, 'people breaking 'em and all that'

Craven says, 'therefore I've come to the conclusion the admin department is worthless'

Craven says, 'interested in what your reply to that is :)'

Tritoch says, 'i got a quexton, before when i was multing someone, the imms would come yell at me and ask for an ic reason, howcome that doesnt happen anymore?'

Craven says, 'truth be told, I haven't SEEN an admin since zandy's return a few weeks ago in months'

Somar says, 'the idea is that you're not supposed to see them'

LadyAce says, 'cuz we have pkok now'

Craven says, 'its no wonder this place is chaos, we have no police force'

Somar says, 'but they're *watching* you ... ...'

Tritoch yells, 'big brother!'

Tritoch goes EEK! at Somar in distress - isn't Somar an awful person for teasing?

Somar whispers quietly to Tritoch.

Craven says, 'as for imms whining about handling harassment issues'

Craven says, 'thats what admin is for'

LadyAce says, 'well, all imms are responsible for seeing the rules enforced'

Craven says, 'if they are whining about it, thats called ruining your own job security :P'

LadyAce says, 'admins are simply experts in how we usually apply the rules & the penalties that go with that'

Craven says, 'uh huh'

Craven says, 'so why aren't they ever here?'

Craven says, 'why is it always you, sandra, or kaige'

LadyAce says, 'I frequently consult them about the penalties I impose'

Craven says, 'not that I mind particuarly'

Craven says, 'you 3 are 3 of the cooler imms around'

LadyAce says, 'and all my decisions are discussed by them afterward'

Craven says, 'so'

Craven says, 'admins are basicly lawyers?'

Craven says, 'not the type in the courtroom, that would be you'

Ubiquity says, 'Well a lower imm gives a warning, or punishment, that gets appealed to a higher imm and so forth, so why not just go to the top in the first place?'

LadyAce says, 'because the top has better things to do'

Craven says, 'they would be the ones in the law library looking up past cases to use as facts etc. to put you away'

LadyAce says, 'people who bug Kaige about anything other than emergencies should be shot :P'

Craven says, 'what does a top admin have better to do'

Craven says, 'I'm really trying to see the reasoning, seriously :P'

Ubiquity says, 'I was explaining most persons thoughts, not my own.'

Somar says to Kaige, 'speaking of which, can I get a restring from you?'

Somar ducks to the ground.

LadyAce says, 'top admin can't be around all the time'

Ubiquity normally bothers assistants with his problems.

Craven says, 'we don't have that many rules to need 5 or 10 lawyers'

LadyAce says, 'it's a matter of coverage and also multiplicity of opinions'

Craven says, 'since what you've said so far basicly says to me that admins are here to interpret the laws set forth by the rules etc.'

Craven says, 'you can't tell me punishments are decided by them'

Craven says, 'since EVERYONE deals out different warnings for everything conceivable'

LadyAce says, 'well, I just said I consult with them about penalties'

Craven says, 'I have a warning for saying crap on chat by kaige'

Craven says, 'but but I can guarentee that sandra wouldn't have warned me for example'

Ea! says to Craven, 'Lemme guess, having a bad day?'

LadyAce says, 'I lock people and ask how long they should stay, I explain a situation and ask for guidance'

Craven says to Ea!, 'actually no :)'

LadyAce says, 'etc etc etc'

Kaige says, 'was more likely for context'

Craven says, 'actually'

Craven says, 'I remember the phrase'

Craven says, 'I said my old character, "creed", was a crappy pkiller and sucked'

Craven says, 'and you warned me'

Craven says, 'but thats alright, I forgive you :)'

LadyAce says, 'well, then the warning was for bad self-esteem :P'

Craven laughs with amusement.

Myrella says to Craven, 'well he was'

Craven says to Myrella, 'I know!'

Craven says, 'thats why I said it'

Myrella says, 'heck my first pkiller beat him'

Craven says, 'thats not the issue :P'

Myrella faints.

Craven says, 'creed sucked my balls'

Darla peers at Craven, looking him up and down.

Craven says to Ea!, 'so why am I having a bad day?'

Craven says, 'I'm just sick of hearing this harassment bullshit'

Craven says, 'thats what admin is for and frankly they aren't doing their job'

LadyAce says, 'well, they just got a new head'

Craven says, 'so you had to step in for them and code things that would force us to follow rules they refused to uphold'

LadyAce says, 'give Zandy a chance to marshall his troops.'

Nemoy flops about helplessly.

Ea! says, 'Most harassment is never reported.'

Craven says, 'I guess you don't have the answers to my questions other then the generic ones'

Craven says, 'so I'm done :)'

LadyAce nods her agreement with Craven.

Craven says, 'what, like rape?'

Ea! says, 'Particularly in an environment such as the old pk one where people fear reprisals.'

Craven snickers softly.

Ea! says, 'Admin can't deal with those.'

Craven says, 'define harassment'



Myrella says, 'so how come guests cant quit while ooc?'

LadyAce says to Myrella, 'woohoo, more odd questions we never thought of! Haven't seen you in a few.'

LadyAce says, 'Hrm, I bet because quit makes you drop your stuff'

LadyAce says, 'and that'd be irritating in the ooc.'

Myrella says, 'so make em eat it when they quit they are only guests :-)'

Tritoch says, 'why do guests even have stuff?'

Craven says, 'to "test" the game'

Fuego says to Tritoch, 'cause we like guests more then you tritoch'

Myrella says, 'so I can DT em when I dont like the colour'

Myrella laughs with amusement.

LadyAce says, 'souonds like a good suggestion, use idea :)'

Kaige says to Myrella, 'there's also other stuff to clean up from the fact they went ooc, like the marker mobs'

Tritoch says, 'but the second you like, wield your dagger, the imms tell you to start a new char not use a guest'

LadyAce nods her agreement with Kaige.

Myrella says, 'Hmmm okies'

Nemoy says, 'dont blame the imms cause you are bored.'

LadyAce says, 'well, guests are a feature in need of enhancement I spose.'

Craven says, 'no they aren't'

Craven says, 'worry about the real characters'

Fuego nods solemnly.

Craven says, 'guests, if interested, can just make one'

LadyAce says, 'I didn't say they were top priority :P'

Craven says, 'and it'll be improved cuz you spent time on real people instead of guests!'

Craven says, 'they'll be like, god damn my newbie is improved!'

Myrella says, 'well at work when I'm using telnet I'm not gonna log a character'

Ellemir says, 'I made a guest first off. If I hadn't liked what I saw, I wouldn't have made real char'

Craven says to Myrella, 'oh wah, I do :P'

LadyAce says, 'but I do think they could use a little more 'guest to the game' type stuff'

Kaige nods her agreement with LadyAce.

Somar says, 'maybe a newbie area'

Myrella says to Craven, 'yep wah'

Somar says, 'like lots of stock muds'

Craven says, 'I think some of the colors are down right scary'

Myrella sniffles quietly.

Somar says, 'sort of a newbie training area :P'

Nemoy shakes his head in disagreement.

Kaige says to LadyAce, 'and some stuff to discourage some of the things they're currently used for'

LadyAce says, 'no, not a training area, ugh'

Nemoy says, 'dont put in a newbie area'

Tobias says, 'Back.'

Tobias flops about helplessly.

Ellemir shudders.

Tritoch says, 'slay somar for suggesting that'

Craven says to Kaige, 'like what'

Lorenzo nods his agreement with LadyAce.

Tritoch bonks Somar on the head!

Nemoy nods his agreement with LadyAce.

Sandra says, 'ugh, who said newbie area? I'm gonna kill 'em'

Craven says, 'somar'

Somar says, 'I said it!'

LadyAce says, 'I was thinking something more like, if you type in 10 or so commands that fail, it prompts you or suggests something'

Sandra whaps Somar across the back of the head - your ears ring in sympathy.

Ellemir says, 'hometowns are better, we can leave when we feel ready, not when the code says we can.'

LadyAce says, 'like running a game in beginner mode'

Somar says, 'honestly, I don't think that's too bad of an idea.. not for all newbies, just for guest types'

Sasha says to LadyAce, 'that's a good idea'

Kaige says to LadyAce, 'could use that in general, not just guests'

Kaige giggles.

Nemoy nods his agreement with LadyAce.

Lorenzo says, 'Guests should be introduced to the way the game actually works.'

Fuego says to Sandra, 'behave!'

Craven says to Kaige, 'god no!'

LadyAce says, 'it'd be irritating in a normal char, I would think...well, depends how it's done.'

Craven says to Kaige, 'what if your spamming something and mistype and its giving you stupid suggestions :P'

Sasha says, 'I think guests should get some easier commands though, like quit that just quits you... quit y is a little arbitrary'

Kaige says to Craven, 'don't spam?'

Craven says, 'I'm a moron'

Sasha says, 'I mean, you can't rent anyway'

Fuego nods his agreement with Craven.

Craven says, 'spam is the name of the game'

Craven says, 'how else to backstab people :P'

Craven says, 'gee'

Craven says, 'don't condemn spam kaige :P'

Craven says, 'you put in a feature to ALLOW people to spam without a client'

Craven says, 'the ! :P'

Kaige says, 'I suspect the number of missed commands in a row would be high, and that it would be failed commands, not failed skills..'


FAQs and Newbies

Ellemir says, 'sometimes I'll make a guest, quit y, just to get a faq to give to a newbie.'

LadyAce says, 'well, you can read them in helps, or get them from an imm.'

LadyAce nods her agreement with Kaige.

Craven says, 'just have a blurb when they log in about looking for nph'

Craven says, 'assuming nph still exists'

Ellemir says, 'Or am I going to have to look for them, since they're an OOC item, not an ingame item.'

Tritoch says, 'they were sposed to be, never happened'

Ellemir nods solemnly.

Sandra says to Craven, 'yes'

Craven says, 'I just had a brilliant idea, does anyone know who the gm of NPH is :P'

Ellemir says, 'stick'

Somar says, 'stick is the one listed in the file'

Sasha says, 'maybe faq should just be a commmand, not a paper'

Somar says, 'lots of newbies go to there'

Somar says, 'not new players though :P'

Mikhail says, 'stick is'

Craven says, 'stick...hmm'

Sasha says, 'cause you gotta know how to read it before reading it'

Craven says, 'I wanna be in nph :P'

Ellemir says, 'lots of lowbies, not newbies'

LadyAce says to Sasha, 'help faq'

Ea! says, 'help faq works.'

Tritoch snickers softly.

Sasha says, 'if you just type "faq" it should list it'

Tritoch says to Craven, 'go for it!'

Sasha says, '*I* know...'

Craven says, 'I help people all the time'

Sasha says, 'I"m just saying a newbie might not know'

Ellemir says, 'that look faq thing gets missed in the spam. newbies lose them.'

Sasha says, 'not even'

LadyAce says to Sasha, 'might be better to teach them to use the help system'

Ellemir says to Craven, 'talk to stick, I think they have one slot free.'

Sasha shrugs helplessly.

Sasha says, 'it was just a suggestion'

LadyAce says to Sasha, 'more consistent'

Craven says to Ellemir, 'they will have more soon'

Somar says, 'it doesn't get lost in the spam unless you set screelen 0 :P'

Tobias says, 'The newbie announcements should happen once you login.'

Mikhail says, 'more now, up to 20'

Ellemir says, 'but if I'm across the mud, and they say how do I eat, and I chat look faq ...'

LadyAce says to Ellemir, 'well, but help faq will always work :)'

Ellemir thanks LadyAce heartily.

Ellemir says, 'and on the subject of newbies, why isn't screenlen 0 the default?'

Sasha says to LadyAce, 'besides... you type "help" and you get help... typing "faq" isn't too inconsistant'

Somar says, 'so they aren't encouraged to just spam everything by like the veterans, I'm sure'

LadyAce says to Ellemir, 'ugh, screenlen 0 is not so good for newbies'

Craven says, 'they read about things they don't know'

Ea! says to Lorenzo, 'Good idea.'

Lorenzo smiles at Ea!.

Somar says, 'same reason brief is set to off, I'd imagine'

Kaige says to Ellemir, 'so maybe they'll have a chance to read HELP RULES as they log in?'

LadyAce says to Ellemir, 'better that they hit enter a few times and at least have a chance to see stuff'

Kaige nods her agreement with LadyAce.

Ellemir says, 'it does affect newbies they take half an hour to catch up with you when you're taking them to their corpse.'

Kaige says, 'so educate them'

LadyAce says to Ellemir, 'if you're going to yank them high speed, explain the command. It'd be even better to walk a bit slower so they can learn the way.'

Lorenzo nods his agreement with LadyAce.

Somar says, 'running people around too fast too soon generates level 50's who don't know how to get to romania from the stag :P'

Ellemir says, 'well, I was just helping someone, explained it twice, and he still said he wasn't keeping up with me.'

Sasha nods her agreement with Somar.

Myrella chuckles politely.

Ellemir says, 'heh, I don't do xp, was just an unseelie CR'

Somar says, 'I know there's some of those around :P'

Sasha says to Somar, 'or trans from indust to med'

Somar nods his agreement with Sasha.

Chaykin nods his agreement with Sasha.

LadyAce says, 'well...every newbie is different :) as a general principle I think a slow walk and lots of explanations are better'

LadyAce says, 'if someone doesn't want to listen to you, they are probably too young for Legend anyway :) :)'

Craven sniffs sadly at LadyAce.

Tritoch says, 'age discrimination!'

Tritoch whaps LadyAce across the back of the head - your ears ring in sympathy.

Lorenzo says, 'I like to take a few steps at a time, explaining where we're going. Sometimes I make the newbie try to lead the 2nd or 3rd time. I try to MAKE people learn their way, in a friendly way.'

LadyAce nods her agreement with Tritoch.

Ubiquity says, 'or stubborn'

Craven was young when he started...

Heineken says, 'most players seem to be too young for Legend...'

Ellemir nods her agreement with Heineken.

LadyAce says, 'a few loud ones are probably too young, and blot out your memory of all those who are just fine :P'


Helps System and Spell Helps

Craven says, 'the help system..'

Craven says, 'I REALLY think the help files should allow you to read helps on skills you don't currently have'

Craven says, 'for example'

Craven says, 'I was leveling a mage'

Craven says, 'and I was trying to decide if I wanted bhu for earthquake or some other word'

Craven says, 'and I couldn't do helps on them to figure out which I thought was better'

Craven says, 'which was annoying'

LadyAce says to Craven, 'there's a battle fought and lost many times over on the imm discussion lists. I don't think it's likely.'

Craven says, 'why!'

Craven says, 'I don't understand how it HURTS legend to let people read help files on things they can't do'

Craven says, 'thats how people learn'

Craven says, 'I read my c++ book and learn'

Craven says, 'I may use it as a reference later'

Craven says, 'but its most useful BEFORE I know it'

Kaige says to Craven, 'you only have to qualify, not already have it'

Somar says, 'but if you can't comprehend the C++ book, it's not very useful to you before you know it'

Craven says, 'the point is kaige'

Craven says, 'to qualify for a spell, you have to waste points on a word'

Craven says, 'so by then you can cast it anyway'

Craven says, 'fine, just change spells, not skills'

Craven says, 'if you qualify for a word, you can do help on spells that use that word'

Craven says to Kaige, 'respond :P'

Craven tickles Kaige.

Kaige says to Craven, 'there may be ones that need checked, but it should be: you have to have the school verb and qualify for words used in it'

Craven says to Kaige, 'thats fine'

Craven says to Kaige, 'for example'

Craven says to Kaige, 'stun is guh lak vya'

Craven says to Kaige, 'you have to have EVERY WORD to do the help'

Kaige says to Craven, 'yeah, you have to have the verb'

Craven says to Kaige, 'if you just had to have chant and guh, taht would be great'

Craven says to Kaige, 'that makes it worthless'

Craven says to Kaige, 'as I'm trying to explain, you want to help to see what is more useful'

Craven says to Kaige, 'its like skills, you type help armslore when you get the stats to see if you think its worth your time'

Kaige says to Craven, 'it's what you just said would be perfect'

Kaige looks at Craven, boggled.

Craven says to Kaige, 'I thought you meant the verb as in guh, vid, kere, ksi, mahi, vina'

Kaige says to Craven, 'that particular one only requieres guh to read'

Craven says to Kaige, 'really'

Craven says to Kaige, 'then I commend you, for that one'

Craven says to Kaige, 'why don't they all?'

Kaige didn't look it up for nothing.

Craven says to Kaige, 'I could even understand third circle spells needing first and 2nd words to help it'

Craven says to Kaige, 'like the lightning spell, kere gam anna, you need kere and gam'

Kaige says to Craven, 'like I said individual ones may need checked.'

Craven says to Kaige, 'but it sorta defeats the point of researching what looks cooler if you can't help until you have it'

Kaige says to Craven, 'talk to other mages'

Craven says to Kaige, 'everyone in this game is so seperated from each other these days thats not possible'

Kaige says to Craven, 'and the second one gam would be a qualify not a have to have'

Craven says to Kaige, 'I could ask on chat about something simple and noone would answer the entire time'


Higher Prereqs on Hunt Help?

Ea! says, 'Maybe we need to move hunt to being a massively high perc skill like it's going to be under trees.'

Craven says to Ea!, 'why?'

Ea! says to Craven, 'So that more people spend the time to learn their way around the mud.'

Somar says, 'hunt isn't neccesarily just in cases where you don't know where you're going'

Myrella says to Ea!, 'hunt is fine with the requirements it has'

Somar says, 'it's extremely useful as a skill for finding wandering mobs and things like that :P'

Myrella says, 'it was a great tool when I first started to find my way around'

Somar says, 'or stupid elves :P'

Ellemir says, 'hunt is good for finding lost people, too.'

Ea! says, 'Oh, I know it's got other uses. It's because it has so many uses that it should be a hard skill to get.'

Ea! says, 'But I'll probably leave it until tracking and the new spell I've got planned go in.'

Myrella says to Ea!, 'and make it a fair bit harder for newbie whiich is not a good idea'

Ellemir says, 'new spell that does similar will go in?'

Craven says, 'hunt as a limited use skill will just make snipers that much more useful'

Ea! says to Myrella, 'Newbies shouldn't be relying on hunt. It'll only hurt them in the long run.'

Ellemir says, 'why not up the level req?'

Somar says, 'relying on hunt is one thing'

Somar says, 'using hunt as a tool to help out a little is another'

Myrella says to Ea!, 'Why? I used it lots to get around initially and now almost never'

LadyAce says, 'the new spell is a spiffy idea I had :) but it's a secret for now'

Craven says to Ea!, 'I still like my wards spell idea :P'


Locate Spell

Ellemir says, 'it'd be nice if the locate spell gave the area as well as the room'

Ea! says to Ellemir, 'Yeah, we might be able to do that, too, at some point.'

LadyAce says, 'I kinda like it without the area'

Ea! giggles.

LadyAce says, 'you're only seeing the person, not a complete trace of their spacial coordinates'

Tritoch says, 'without the area is better'

Tritoch says, 'cause then you gotta explore to remember where rooms are!'

Ea! says, 'It does encourage people to learn the mud.'

Tritoch nods to himself - he must be getting senile.

Tritoch stares off into space.

Myrella says, 'its usually not that hard to figure out where a locate is'

Tritoch nods his agreement with Ea!.

Ellemir says, 'I don't learn hunt until level 30. Locate spell is all I have for finding people.'

Craven says, 'hunt though, in its own way, helps you learn the mud'

Craven says, 'an example would be I learned hell through hunt'

Craven says, 'even though, sadly, it no longer exists'

Craven says, 'through repitition I no longer needed to hunt'

Ellemir says, 'a cramped room I got earlier today on locate spell. who knows where that is?'

Sandra does.

Craven says, 'hehe, pk would be funny if half the pkillers in the game didn't qualify for it'

Ea! says to Ellemir, 'It's an odds game -- sometimes you'll know, sometimes you won't. '

Myrella laughs with amusement.

Craven says, 'its probably in one of sandras areas :P'

Ellemir nods her agreement with Ea!.

Sandra shakes her head in disagreement with Craven.

Tritoch says, 'it would rule, make you all suffer like my tank does'

Ellemir says, 'I found it. Its in RB.'

Craven says, 'interesting'

Ea! says, 'And often you can learn more by casting it more than once.'

LadyAce says, 'I like that you have to ponder where a cramped room might be...or whatever'

Craven says, 'a lot of mobs don't move'

Craven says, 'or move very very slow'

Tritoch says, 'who uses locate on a mob!?'

Tritoch peers around the room intently.

Craven says, 'if your proposing casting it multiple times, lower the mana cost :P'

LadyAce says to Tritoch, 'lop mobs?'

Craven nods his agreement with LadyAce.

Myrella nods her agreement with LadyAce.

Craven says, 'I located limerick the other day'

Ellemir says, 'I use it for helping lost lowbies. and yeah, LoP mobs.'

Kae says, 'wandering aggro mobs'

Tritoch says, 'nooo, just find one, the others are always within 3 rooms'

Craven says, 'aren't many of those'

Craven says, 'unless you count augustus'

Craven grumbles to Sandra.

Sandra says, 'hehe'

Kae says, 'nuh, I count the one that multi'd me today cuz I didn't locate it'

Kae grumbles.

Ea! says to Craven, 'It's already got a low mana cost.'

Craven says, 'the dhurtah sorta is'

Craven says to Ea!, 'you think 40 is low?'

Ellemir says to Kae, 'that was one of yours wasn't it?'

Kae nods her agreement with Ellemir.

Craven says, 'wow....sometimes I really feel distanced from you imms :P'

Kae giggles.

Craven says, 'I feel like we play 2 different games sometimes, hehe'

Craven says to Ea!, '40 is well over the average cost of a spell'

Ea! says to Craven, 'I misread the cost.'

Craven nods his agreement with Ea!.

Craven says, 'wonder what the exact aveage is'

Craven says, 'probably like 25ish'

Craven says, 'spells like greater demons, create item, etheric archer, raise dead, those tend to skew it a bit though'

Ea! says, 'Of course, most mages have enough mana that 40 isn't a major cost.'

Craven says, 'thats like 5%'

Craven says, 'thats quite a bit'

Ea! says, 'that's like a tick's worth of regen or something. That's not too bad.'

Craven says, '40 mana to a cause mage is approxomately 60-70 damage on a firestorm'

Craven says, 'could mean life and death :)'

Ellemir says, 'not much mana to most high level mages. but by the time I'm high level, I have hunt anyway.'

Ea! says to Craven, 'Right, well, it's got to be enough that there's a tradeoff to casting it.'

Craven chuckles politely.

Ea! says, ''cause it's not a wimpy do-nothing spell.'

Craven says, 'I was merely arguing because you were supporting the idea of casting it multiple times'

Craven says, 'actually, I have a real question'

Craven says, 'how are you coming on fixing roots to not be stupid? :)'

Ea! says, 'Still looking for an idea that I like.'

Ubiquity says, 'clarify stupid.'

Somar prays for cure serious - it's still in his spellbook!

Craven says, 'ugh'

Craven says, 'your too hard to please'

Craven pokes Ea! in the ribs.

Ea! nods his agreement with Craven.

Myrella says, 'removing the association with roots and food'

Craven says, 'I still don't see whats wrong with the pill idea'

Myrella grumbles.

Craven says, 'how about 3rd circle gets create super healing, which for 70 mana creates a 50 hp band aid :P'

Ea! says to Craven, 'I don't want to make them pills 'cause then they conflict with all of the pill skills that we've got planned.'


Limits on Charmed Mobs

Somar says, 'is anything being done about limitations of charmies at all? some of these armies are just downright excessive...'

Craven says, 'I'm all for making skeletons timed since they are so much better then creates :P'

Somar really thinks create mages get a downright unfair advantage in all sorts of combat if patient enough, as wel as cause mage armies :P

Craven snickers at Somar nastily.

Myrella says, 'just let the mage only have one animated creature at a time'

Craven says, 'go make an army and meditate while starving so you can heal should things go wrong'

Somar says, 'portion a created meal :P'

Ea! says, 'Nothing's currently planned, but we can look into it.'

Craven says, 'now you've lost 100-200 hp of healing power'

Somar says, 'have small snacks to keep yourself from starving...'

Craven says, 'out of a max cap of like 250-400'

Somar says, 'one portion is like one tick, or half of one root :P'

Somar says, 'so about 20 hps :P'

Craven says to Ea!, 'how about you create an item that somehow heals you'

Tritoch says, 'whats the problem with skeletons? not like we can use more than 4, and not like they hurt or anything'

Tritoch peers around the room intently.

Myrella says, 'they stop you from being hurt though'

Craven says, 'because you can have 20 spread out of the mud that never die'

Somar nods his agreement with Myrella.

Lorenzo nods his agreement with Craven.

Craven says, 'I used to make 3 mil xp in an hour without losing an hp with sammael'

Tritoch says, 'they are already timed?'

Craven says, 'no they aren't'

Tritoch says, 'havent they been for months now?'

Ellemir says, 'so what's the problem with that?'

Somar nods his agreement with Craven.

Somar says, 'that's the sort of thing'

Craven says, 'so cause mages aren't supposed to be the charmie kings'

Ellemir says, 'ah'

Craven says, 'create is'

Ellemir nods solemnly.

Somar says, 'really, charmie kings of the cause or create persuasion are kinda a bit much'

Craven says, 'if cause has the same charmy power as create, whats creates advantage?'

Craven says, 'flamestrike? :P'

Somar says, 'due to being able to run 3mil xp/hour without taking any damage :P'

Ellemir says, 'preserve, and that's no advantage any more.'

Tritoch says, 'dream sending'

Somar says, 'etheric archer is a nice create thing, but it's bad if your opponent gets a chance to run :P'

Tritoch whaps Craven across the back of the head - your ears ring in sympathy.

Craven says, 'etheric archer isn't that great'

Craven says, 'he doesn't do much damage'

Somar says, 'but he's so cool!'

Ellemir says, 'i'm dex create, I want them to run, then I don't have to split the xp.'

Craven says, 'I've seen him go tons of rounds without ever shooting'

Somar thinks flaming sword shouldn't be illusionary, too :P

Somar ducks to the ground.

Craven says, 'I already tried convincing sandra of that :)'

Ea! says, 'we're working on some ideas for create. And we'll look into the charmie situation.'

Craven says, 'I like create, to a degree'

Ellemir says, 'please don't take away from create charmies when you look at charmies.'

Craven says, 'its just really disheartening to see some cause mage have a far better charmy power then I do'

Craven says, 'since I don't really do any damage with my mana'

Ea! says, 'Okay, I understand that people think cause has too much charmie power.'

Craven says, 'heh :)'

Craven says, 'back to the healing!'

Craven says, 'someone think of a good way for create to heal!'

Kae says, 'more like, they can park charmies too well?'

Ellemir says, 'heh, for what, 150 mana, they spend on a skelly, I can get 7 homunculi, of up to 180hps, and have 10 mana change.'

Khelben waves hello to the world!

Somar thinks create has too much charmie power too.

Sandra nods her agreement with Ellemir.

Craven says, 'how about kere drva rudh, which creates a charmy doctor'

Craven says, 'and the doctor can be ordered to operate'

Khelben says, 'i dont like cause charmies would rather they removed the spell and gave us something more useful'

Ellemir says to Somar, 'it's all we've got.'

Craven says, 'but he has really low mana and poofs fast :P'

Khelben says, 'i dont use em cause i cant ever get a zombie'

Somar says, 'it's not really'

Somar says, 'I don't mean take away charmies...'

Craven says, 'or gets a set number of operates'

Somar says, 'just limit them to some degree'

Khelben says, 'thats just my experience i would like a dopple or something that can carry stuff for me'

Craven says, 'carts'

Craven says, 'huginn coded them'

LadyAce says, 'carts are spiff'

Craven says, 'builders just haven't used them'

Craven says, 'can carts float?'

Ellemir says, 'you have recall, so you can recall either to an inn or your house. You don't need to carry stuff.'

Khelben says, 'just reinstalled windows computer works nice'

Khelben says, 'thats not the point i cant carry more then 5 bandages without being encumbered'

Myrella says, 'raise your str :P'

Khelben says, 'and i dont see the point in wasting 150 mana on a skeleton that can't even wield a weapon for me'

Somar still misses the ultimate in charmie type assault.

Khelben says, 'its already at 41'

Khelben says, 'dont need it no higher'


KG vs LBS & Weight

Craven says, 'I just realized a kilogram is like 2.2 pounds'

Craven says, 'meaning I'm currently carrying over 100 pounds on my person...'

LadyAce nods her agreement with Craven.

Khelben says, 'bandages are nuts here in weight'

LadyAce says to Craven, 'neat trick. We can't do half kgs, so...'

Somar says, 'it will never be cooler then old ankus coupled with a flying hathi and warcry :P'

Kae says, 'my cause mage has 43 str with the spell and can carry 3000 coins, tho'

Somar says, 'maybe half kg should be doable :P'

Khelben says, 'i cant lift more then 1k'

Sandra says, 'oy, mine has 35 with the spell and can carry 7k'

Khelben says, 'im currently carrying 3kg'

Khelben says, '63kg'

Myrella says, 'ah the lovely 1kg bandages'

Myrella gets a cloth bandage from her cleavage.

Somar is a wuss too - he commonly has to wear this huge camping backpack to carry anything :P

Somar brandishes Patchy, the patchwork bag menacingly.

Myrella beams at a cloth bandage delightedly - such materialism!

Khelben says, 'hell shane had 100 str and could barely move with 80 truffles'

Craven snickers at Khelben nastily.

Myrella puts a cloth bandage in her cleavage.

Khelben says, 'yet he can walk around with 15k'

Somar says, 'why not either do half kgs, or just switch to pounds?'

Somar says, 'which are basically half kgs anyway'

Kaige says to Somar, 'regardless of unit name, the smallest we can go is 1'

Khelben says, 'cant 2 bandages equal 1 kg?'

Somar says, 'i know, but, if we switch to pounds and allow carrying twice as much :P'

Ubiquity looks up into the sky and ponders.

Somar says, 'and then just double the weight of current items...'

Somar says, 'it'd have some fairly large implications as far as weapon weights go'

Ea! says to Khelben, 'That's what "roll" is for. Not ideal, but....'

Khelben says, 'to me it seems like im carryng around a box of gauze bandages'

Khelben says, 'even rolls'

Somar says, 'but I think a switch like that would be a feasible option'

Kaige repeats the smallest unit we have working with integers is 1.

Khelben nods his agreement with Kaige.

Khelben says, 'i know'

Craven says, 'so base it on ten'

Ellemir says, 'why do notes have weight, is that so all the RPers will go for high str?'

Khelben says, 'and how much of this actually has to do with my dex dropping to 40'

Somar says, 'i know the lowest is still 1 :P'

Khelben says, 'it seems when my dex was above 40 i could carry 6k in coins and move'

Somar says, 'but if you can carry twice as many...'

Craven says, 'and make it 10 equals 1 unit of measure'

LadyAce says, 'notes have weight so that people don't accumulate bazillions of them'

Myrella grins evilly.

Kaige says to Ellemir, 'think of 8K times how many notes you're carrying. Costly disk-space'

Chaykin says, 'you're already limited to 20 notes on your person'

Khelben says, 'i jsut mail the important ones back to mysel'

Tritoch nods his agreement with Chaykin.


Mana costs on failed spells

Ellemir says, 'what about reducing mana cost of fly & preserve spells if we typo, and don't have a target. Its annoying to lose 25 mana when you've typed preserve chaice'

Ea! says to Ellemir, 'Bug that one?'

Ellemir says, 'and the same with fly spell.'

Ellemir says, 'I'm not talking about the dam spells, just the non-dam ones.'


Recall/Rent while Fighting

Craven says, 'is it possible to make it so when you wake up from stunned or are attacked by a few specials you are considerd fighting right away'

Craven says, 'I'm sick of people renting and recalling on things like firestorms and backstabs'

Craven says, 'without fleeing'

Ea! says to Craven, 'Probably what we should do is make it so that you can't recall if someone is fighting you....'

Craven says, 'you can't'

Craven says, 'you can't recall while fighting'

Craven says, 'but some spells/skills don't set you to fighting right away'

Ea! says to Craven, 'You can if you're not fighting.'

Ea! says, 'The problem is that when you wake up from stunned, you're not fighting -- they opponent is fighting you, but you don't fight until after combat is reinitiated....'

Craven says to Ea!, 'why'

Somar really thinks you shouldn't be able to rent if someone is fighting you, as well....

Ea! says to Craven, 'cause you're standing up, etc., not fighting.'

Craven says, 'if your standing up etc'

Craven says, 'you shouldn't be able to recall either'

Craven says, 'or rent'

Craven says, 'you should be in a state of recovery'

Ea! says to Somar, 'Right -- that's why I proposed that as the solution.... check to see if someone is fighting you.'

Somar nods his agreement with Ea!.

Ea! says to Craven, 'Right, but that's hard to track, whereas "is someone fighting me" is fairly easy.'

Somar has run into that particular problem a time or two in the past.

Craven says to Ea!, 'I understand, your solution is good, just didn't understand it the way you worded it'

Craven says, 'seems like it checks that now though'

Craven says, 'or does it check tos ee if YOUR fighting'

Craven says, 'maybe thats the problem'

Craven says, 'I dunno :P'

Ea! says, 'right.'

Kae says, 'what happens, then, if I run from someone, and they hunt me down every once in a while to take a potshot, will I eventually be considered not fighting?'

Craven says to Kae, 'what he's saying is when you wake up from stunned, YOUR not fighting, but the other person is'

Craven says to Kae, 'so recall and rent work'

Ea! nods his agreement with Craven.

Craven says to Kae, 'if the check was changed to check if they are attacking you'

Craven says to Kae, 'you couldn't'

Somar says, 'and if you just woke up from stunned, you get the nice message "Shoot who?"'

Kae says to Craven, 'yeah, but what I mean is, what keeps the other person from keeping the combat on endlessly?'

Craven says, 'fleeing?'

Craven says, 'one of you dying?'

Craven says, 'like normal?'

Ea! says to Somar, 'Yep, same reason.'

Craven says, 'I don't really see where your coming from'

Kae fails to get her point thru.

Craven says, 'when you try to recall or rent, it just checks to see if you are the target of anyone'

Craven says, 'not to see if you are targetting anyone'

Ea! says to Kae, 'The other person starts attacking shortly thereafter automatically.'

Kae says to Craven, 'I'm fighting you, I run like a squirrel, you follow -- I can't rent cuz you're fighting me -- what's to stop you from forcing me to stay on-line for hours that way?'

Craven says to Kae, 'in a stun, you don't have to reattack'

Craven says to Kae, 'the mud does it for you'

Ellemir says, 'is your point that it's just as valid for you to recall/rent, as it is for craven to not want you to recall/rent?'

Somar says, 'because, if you run away, you stop fighting'

Craven says to Kae, 'your talking about something different'

Craven says, 'as it stands'

Kae says, 'no, I just don't want to see people forced to not rent for hours :)'

Somar says, 'if they take another shot at you, you can run to an inn before their skilllag lets them catch up to you'

Kae nods solemnly.

Craven says, 'if you wfw me'

Kae says, 'okie dokie, then we're in agreement'

Craven says, 'when I wake up, technically I'm not fighting you'

Ea! says, 'Oh! I see the question.'

Craven says, 'but your still attacking me'

Ea! says, 'Yeah, once the other person flees, the fight stops.'

Kae nods solemnly.

Kae says, 'that's what I wanted to hear'

Craven cheers for Kae - huzzah!

Ea! says, 'Or is recalled, or whatever.'

Craven smiles at Kae.

Craven says, 'its just a loophole as it is'

Kae feared more whining from safe rooms.

Craven says, 'its a way to rent/recall while basicly fighting'

Craven says, 'technicality'

LadyAce thinks we're all done & stuff :)

LadyAce waves happily.

LadyAce gives a big hug to everyone in the room.


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